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best : science :
[+] ballot by Tommo

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

notice this is in the science section not politics!

Correct without question
Incorect without a question
Impossible to be sure, so they're just being nieve
Correct with a question (a few, maybe)
Immediately question their funding
They are most likely right
Volcanoes are the culprits.
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Submitted by : Tommo
Submitted on : Aug 21,2006 10:27:23 am
ballot title:

What do you think about people who tell you "We Cause Global Warming!!"?

ballot number:100816
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Do not rate it negative just because you do not agree with the ballot or the result.

They(scientists)do put forward a good arguement for a sharp increase in temps since the onset of the industrial revolution.
I think they are probably correct, even if that truth does inconvenience rich industrialists.
So far 3 out of 4 voters think they understand the science enough to say we 'DEFINATLY' cause global warming
I had to add that choice... I don't think it's impossible to be sure, but I don't think that global warming has been researched enough to be taken without question.
Or perhaps ask what caused the previous period of global cooling followed by warming that have been occuring at a regular 10,000 year interval for as long as we can dig back in our history, even prior to mankind.

Maybe ask why mars is likewise undergoing global warming. Or why if it's hotter than it's been in a thousand years, as they claim, why was it so damn hot 1000 years ago? Or ask them what happened to global cooling that they were so excited about not so long ago. Or ask them if they realize that the world has gone up by only 1 degree in the past century, and has not gone up at all in the past decade.

There are alot of questions really.

I don't know what I think, but I DO know what I say.

How was your bike ride to school/work/welfare office today?

one good question is, Why is it impossible for some 'educated' people to question, much less imagine, what can happen to this planet as the one species who creates acres of trash per person builds huge stinking metal cities and dumps every kind of junk imaginable into the oceans? Well what if this species doubles it's population to 6.6 billion in just Forty years and tripples it's trashiness? hmmm what a puzzle :p
by Jyl [+]

oh shit i just realized who's ballot this is and what's it's really about!! I am so sorry Tommo, please don't start that old stuff all over.., oh no.
Really, fighting with ME on the internet isn't going to prove anything to either of us or anyone else. Shit, I know I messed up, please.. I forgot this was yours, you don't make ballots that often.
by Jyl [+]

I tried to delete it Tommo and they will not go away, please erase them for me, I would NOT have commented on one of your ballots, I would have stayed away instead of start up again with how awful it was, all the anger and names.
Please try to rate them all down and delete them for me, sugar
by Jyl [+]

Jyl: why is it impossible for educated people to admit the plain fact that this same scenario has played out dozens, or even hundreds of times in the past, long before we ever came down out of the trees to build our first coal powered SUV.
Herzog, nobody disputes that this same scenario has played out dozens, or even hundreds of times in the past, however, the difference this time is that its is happening at a much faster rate than in the past which would seem to indicate that we are in fact accellerating the process.
I admit that too hz- it's not impossible for me.
Is it impossible to imagine 6.6 billion people making Any impact?
(I tried again this morning Tommo and it isn't working. I know you'll make me sorry today, I'm just gonna stay away from all of this.)
by Jyl [+]

minni: but that's the thing, there is no proof that it's going on faster than before. The main difference between every other time and this one is that we're around to measure it this time around.

And why is it happening on mars as well?

Jyl: again, you fall into your old routine. I made a ballot about that. 100838

okay fine great. so do you think there is Anything we can or should do together to try to help the future?
None of the ballots about Environmentalism lately are by alarmist/extremist guilt layer-on'ers, they're only by people putting environmentalists down. Doing that over and over doesn't prove anything, it gets silly pretty quick actually.
Someone has to care about it to the extreme, just like someone will always go off 100% about everything in the world.. why once here at B&W someone proudly said that New Orleans should have been wiped out completely and no one said a single word to them about their feeling.. no one made three ballots in a row just to draw attention to their beleif.. if they had it wouldn't have changed anyone's mind about it.
Carry the Anti-Environmentalist campagne a lot furthur if you need to but I'm not sure what you're accomplishing, even with that ballot, all it did was say how we shouldn't concern ourselves with it. Well don't worry, we're not gonna change, people like me will worry about the tons of trash each suburbanite produces but it is not going to change your life. Make more ballots about it.
by Jyl [+]

They have been measuring temperature for cenuries now and the palnet has been getting warmer steadily, then low and behold, the industrial revolution started and the temps increased ten fold, that cant be mere coincedence.
Herzog, I couldnt post the link on here it was too long so I sent it to your public messages.
Voted : Impossible to be sure, so they're just being nieve
Jyl - Again(!!), I will make it clear that I hate the way we treat our planet. I hate polution (obviously), I also agree that we should try and decrease the amount of emmisions we release in to the environment, because we 'COULD' contribute to the causes of global warming, and we 'DO' cause localised pollution.

I know it upsets you how we treat our planet. It is the same for me.

I wrote this ballot because I wanted to see how people voted. I am interested. As it seems you are, otherwise you wouldn't have left a comment in the first place. Or come back after saying you wouldn't.

Again you come flying in with a rediculously antagonistic and missguided approach.

It shows great Nievity to think that saying the following would in any way link to the ballot question, or in any way imply that we cause global warming.

- "Well what if this species doubles it's population to 6.6 billion in just Forty years and tripples it's trashiness? hmmm what a puzzle"

Mini - with complete respect for your statement, it 'could' be complete coincidence. It really could. Random rises and falls in temperatures have occured throughout the geolical record. The smaller the time span the less we know about the fluctuations. As we can only date rocks to at the most, the nearest 1000yrs, it is clear that we dont know how often and at what speeds previous fluctuations in temperatures have been.

In fact, in most climate sciences the studies undertaken dont even look at smaller than 500/1000 year fluctuations. Our dating and analytical techniques are not that accurate.
Therefor the data from the past few hundred years is all we've got to go on. This data is clearly insufficient. If you pick 1 500 yr sample of data from a system which has been around for millions of years, you will not get a fair representative sample of what has happened throughout.

This 500 yrs may well have had less fluctuations than before, or a higher range of fluctuations. Who knows..? we dont have any other data to compare this last 500 yrs with. So we cant know.

It may not be a coincidence , so lets stop pumping shit in to the air we breathe.... but we may not be the cause of global warming!

"global warming" is all You're issue Tommo. I've never said a word about "global warming", find where I have. I have a hard time taking anyone seriously who doesn't acknowledge the difference we are making and how fast we need to change. This planet is not adapting well to our exploding population and our huge stinking concrete cities.. no to mention our mountains (per town) of trash and all the things we're spilling into the water and the air.
My mean (sorry boys) comment FOUR MONTHS ago that wasn't even at You (I had thought you were pretty cool.) is what started you on the name-calling. I was giggling when I typed it, because though I have very little respect for people lately with how I see them trashing everything beautiful, I've learned to laugh at it and save myself the worry. I spend more time laughing every day :) and it's almost always what I'm doing at B&W. I've assumed most everyone else read me that way.
I've really learned a lot from you.
by Jyl [+]

okay excuse me, I Did Quote people repeating "global warming, global warming" before, so in case you need to again turn my QUOTE around on me then please, let it be known, I have not faught to prove "global warming" here. I've always known that if I did then people would jump right out at me, but heck it's happened anyway when I was just making myself laugh :p Now it's the four-month fight!
by Jyl [+]

oh wait, you said you couldn't understand my wacky grammer! Let me know if I need to say it more periods and punctuation.
by Jyl [+]

Jyl: so have you done any of the things I've suggested to stop tornados? What!?!?! You think they'll be meaningless?

Okay fine great. So do you think there is Anything we can or should do together to try to help the future?

actually herzog, I kinda like tornadoes. I have a lot more respect for nature than I do for any person in the world, my family accepts this about me but you don't have to, don't even bother pathoming it.

ME, yesterday, "Okay fine great. So do you think there is Anything we can or should do together to try to help the future?"
by Jyl [+]

by Jyl [+]

Jyl- Jyl - Jyl - Just shut up!

I too thought you were OK, until I disagreed with something you said and you started laying in to me, stereotyping me and judging me.

I then decided that you must be a bit of a tit, prick, twatt etc..... so thats what I told you.

I wish this shit would fucking stop. Why cant I ask a straight forwards question without you getting the wrong end of the stick.

I hope we can end this crap now. I cant be bothered and you say you cant. So why not just back off!

Jyl - 1 more ting - "I have a hard time taking anyone seriously who doesn't acknowledge the difference we are making and how fast we need to change"

I've clearly stated I understand that. In fact during the comment before yours.

oh yeah, "started laying in to me"
Again, Tommo- This was over four months ago, You have brought this up.
Again, Tommo- The only issue I ever had with you was all the silly names you stooped to calling me over a sarcastic (yes, kinda mean ;) thing that was not directed at you at all.
And now you add a few more names on.. proving what?
Please go on and on cussing for days over this, you're teaching so much to anyone who's seen this.
Never give up fighting with me, carry it as far as you need to, Bye Tommo.
by Jyl [+]

Urrrr - I only respond to your most recent comments -

I dont really care what happened 4 months ago - You seem obsessed with that!

I've been travelling around Europe for the past 2/3 months. Seriously!

Most of my comments have been in response to comments you have made recently.

Lets both stop NOW!

We seem like a whinging couple!

And we dont want that!

I think they are leftist

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